It was the best debate of them all, and made the last English debate looked like an out of control kindergarten.
The moderator Patrice Roy was a real professional, there were good questions from real journalists. And there were far fewer insults.
But despite that, there was no clear winner.
Despite what the Cons were quick to claim. Again.
Which only proves, again, that they are more of a cult than a political party, and far too dangerous to ever be allowed to govern this country.
Especially since Scheer had another mediocre night calling Justin Trudeau a liar over and over again.
As only a serial liar could.
Another candidate who delivered a mediocre performance was Jagmeet Singh.
It became only too obvious last night that he likes to repeat one-liners he has memorized.
Over and over again.
And he even had to be reminded at one point by the moderator that the topic was immigration not pipelines.
Or that what he said in French was not the same as what he said in English.
Luckily for him Elizabeth May was even worse...
Her French was so bad, that at one point my poor French-speaking companion was forced to ask me what she was saying. And I thought she would have been clearer if she had used sign language.
Maxime Bernier even in his first language was also predictably bad, and at times sounded even more crazy than racist, which I suppose is progress.
While Yves-François Blanchet starred in the best exchange of the evening, for all the wrong reasons.
👋👋👋👋👋— SpunkyCalgary (@calgary_spunky) October 11, 2019
Best Moment of #debatdeschefs2019
Justin Trudeau sits as he calmly👏
watches the children fight🤦♂️
🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️#cdnpoli #CanadaVotes #IStandWithTrudeau #AndrewScheerCannotBeTrusted pic.twitter.com/KbeMDQaMeO
While Justin Trudeau sat down and laughed.
But he won't be laughing for long, because the Bloc leader could soon be making a deal with Cons to support a Con minority.
So Quebec can get all the goodies it wants, while Scheer and his gang shove one or more pipelines up the ass of British Columbia. Vive le Quebec Libre !!!!
Let them not say I didn't warn them.
Finally, to the best of my knowledge, I seem to be the only one who found it bizarre that although medicare is a big priority for Canadians.
None of the debate organizers thought it was a subject worth discussing.
And that warning still stands.
We have ten days to fight for the country we love.
Or we could lose it.
Happy Thanksgiving everybody!!!!
36 comments:
I didn't watch, but Sheer stupidity's ISIS at the border and killing our women and children wasn't visible . Buy the poor dolt an SUV; he's getting no traction.
Happy Thanksgiving, Simon. I hope the turkeys (or Canada geese) are smart enough not to vote for their own slaughter. (By dismembering the vote among orange squash, green beans and a Bloc of French cheese.)
Hopefully the Liberals scooping the Cons on all those cuts is enough to piece a happy ending back together.
I agree that no health-care question was absolutely out rageous. Also outrageous was that every single major debate was in Quebec, the East and West Coasts got screwed on debates, and Quebec issues dominated the debates. It was really unfair to the rest of Canada and their issues.
Stll Jagmeet Singh still won not just because of his one liners, although they make great news clips with staying power, but also because Trudeau fucked himself royally in Quebec.
First off threatening to intervene in Bill 21, a hollow threat of course, but one he made to distance himself from Black Face. Secondly he backed the idea of pipelines into Quebec, which is a none starter. Thirdly he was as interesting as a funeral, his hope amd change all gone, Quebecers are inspired by passion amd Trudeau had none. And fourthly the other person who had a great debate was Bernier, which seems like it would be good for Trudeau as it will eat into Scheer's votes, but a lower Scheer makes it feel safer to choose Jagmeet, the leader people want, over the lying clown Trudeau they fear they have to accept.
I still have hope we will see Jagmeet in a minority.
I was hoping you had watched the debate and would blog on it -- great to know what happened. Yes, I agree that I am also concerned the Bloc would support a Con minority rather than a Lib minority -- their roots are from the PC party, as I recall, and so they always had that tilt.
Sorry Bernie Bro, Jughead is the lying clown. Nice Trump language, BTW, typical of a saboteur proudly espousing the horseshoe dynamic and throwing a spanner in the works to make the perfect the enemy of the good. Is Justin also a dopey crippled loser? Your boy has been misrepresenting Liberal policy positions all over Twitter because he's either ignorant of provincial/federal jurisdiction or is doing the usual progressive pony bullshit of making pie-in-the-sky platitudes to low-info voters. Free shit for everyone! Sock man bad! He's getting pimped in Con papers by Con pundits and Warren Kinsella who just want to split the vote. Bernie Obama has zero integrity and is a self-serving hack who's perfectly happy to bask in the attention as long as he can elevate his profile, save his sorry ass from a leadership review and high-five Andy Trump over blocking a "coronation." Because it's 2016!
Tragic irony that a white guy who is otherwise a sincere fighter against bigotry and discrimination but had a bizarre habit of minstrel performance in his youth gets "Bloc"-ed by two ethnic nationalist parties making a useful idiot of a brown guy in a turban. Well, I hope Jagoff and his cult of personality that you apparently belong to are happy to sell out to the silver-tongued separatist who was for Quebexit before it was cool and the austerity-fanatic Internet troll who thinks not liking a carbon tax makes it acceptable to insinuate that his political rivals are pedophiles. That's the lot that you Dippers are throwing in with because of your revenge fetish against Trudeau. But hey, Jughead won't help the Cons, right? He promised! Except, HE ALREADY IS!
Jerkweed will have zero input with Le Pen and Le Pence, and probably end up thrown in the camps just the same, but hey, you delusional Dippers got your moral victory against "Blackface Trudeau" (or is that "Hot Sauce Hillary"?) and really taught him a lesson about private email servers -- er, electoral reform, didn't you? Love and courage? Bullshit! More like fear and loathing on the campaign trail 2019!
I haven't heard or seen anything about Trudeau advocating a pipeline through Quebec. Could you give me a reference ?
ask Luciean Bouchard
BQ in huge damage control today over the phony mea culpas of five of their candidates' demonstrative bigotry towards muslims, compounded by Blanchet's abrasiveness at the french media's pointed questions to him of why he isn't shedding them as Bloq candidates. More to come.
we have voted here already
and thanks to first pass the post
(the elimination of was a Trudeau promise... broken)
my vote that has never mattered
or counted for anyone going to ottawa
for the last 50 years
will again help no one.
just here to experience the vitriol
it's a canadian election,eh?
everyone will be dissapointed in the morning
"Andrew Scheer wins debate!"
LOL!!! Like everything else that emanates from his mouth, bullshit. The Cons could easily reach the Paris climate accord's carbon reductions if they would simply STFU.
JD
Steve, check wikipedia and spell people's names correctly.
A neighbour who had been planning to vote Bloc won't because of Blanchet's abrasiveness and narrow nationalism. She is unsure whether to vote NDP or spoil her ballot.
Actually, the Bloc has roots among Québec nationalist cons, but also the labour left (Duceppe, Francine Lalonde, Pierre Paquette, Osvaldo Nunez...
What one calls a "rotten bloc".
Mainstreet called me! :D
Hi rumleyfips...lies, the sight of Scheer at the border was truly pathetic, since the situation is under control and it was only too obvious why he was there. But he wanted to make sure that Bernier didn't steal any of his bigot votes, so the ugly American just couldn't help himself....
It won't matter Scott. French racists and a useless socialist vanity party that should have folded up 20 years ago have a good chance of leading Canada to austerity and Christofascism. Then absolve themselves of any responsibility for their actions because waaaaaa but her emails but electoral reform. There are no words this morning for how much I hate -- like really, gut-level hate -- the Dippers and Blocheads with the fire of a thousand burning Toronto Suns. About as much as I hated the brogressive Bernouts and their cult leader in 2016 and still wish ill upon them to this day.
Hi Jackie....thank you, and a happy Canadian Thanksgiving to you too. I'm not happy at the way the election campaign has gone, but I will take time to give thanks for having had a chance to live in this country before fascism descended upon it. And whatever happens I'll never stop fighting for that Canada....
Hi Gyor....It would have been much better for Trudeau not to say anything about Bill 21, but he's the prime minister, and he felt he had to stand up for those who are being discriminated against. Secondly, Trudeau is not pushing for a pipeline through Quebec, only Scheer is doing that. But I do agree that Trudeau was strangely flat, and I attribute that to the long smear campaign the Cons have waged against him, which has been ongoing for almost ten months. Finally, although I would have preferred a majority to teach those grubby Cons a lesson, a Liberal/NDP minority government would be fine as far as I'm concerned. Remember, I was the one who spent almost ten years calling for progressives to unite. And the only thing I fear is a vote split that could return the Cons to power...
Hi Cathie....The Bloc leader claims he's not interested in joining a coalition, but I don't believe that. I believe he had to say that or many of his supporters would drop like a hot potato. They may be inflamed with that idiot Bill 21, but not to the degree of getting the Cons to return to power. At least I hope so. It's been a few years since I wandered through the so called Quebec profound, so I have no idea what the people who live there are really thinking. What I do know is that the more people in the rest of Canada attack Bill 21, the more popular it will become in the province. Some things never change....
Hi lungta...Gawd, and I thought I was feeling a bit blue, and I'm sorry you feel that way. But those who blame everything on electoral reform are barking up the wrong tree. ER is not some kind of magic talisman that will miraculously cure everything from our democratic woes to cancer. The NDP were the ones who torpedoed it by siding with the Cons, and agreeing to a referendum which would have failed, and buried ER for a generation. It has been rejected by Canadians over and over again, so blame Canadians, and the ratty partisan Nathan Cullen, not Trudeau....
Hi Scott...Yes, I saw Blanchet piously assuring people that anti-Muslim bigotry was deplorable etc etc and that the Bloc was above that. But between him and his grubbly pal Legault they are using racism for crass political purposes and shaming our province. I am fully aware that many of them see it as an extension of the secularism that was born during the Quiet Revolution, but telling people what they can or cannot wear is absurd and only makes them look like bigots whether they are or not...
Hi rumleyfips...lithe reason you haven't heard about it, is because Trudeau is not pushing for a Quebec pipeline. Like his father he can be a bit hamfisted when dealing with Quebec, but he knows that the environmental movement is very strong in that province, so Quebecers will never go for it, unlike the Big Oil tool Scheer....
Jughead even lying about the Greens to elevate his profile. Fuck that guy. I hate that fucking Quisling and I hate his cult. Fight the real enemy, and it's not Trudeau. Typical Red Rose Tea Party: friendly fire to own the neolibs.
Simon, I have no problem with you supporting the Liberals, though it does make me sad. However, a poster talking about French racists and a useless socialist vanity party is over the top. Remember, we all met through rabble.
Jackie, I don't expect you to know that there has been a lot of anti-French racism here against Québécois, Acadians and others, and a toxic stew of anti-French and anti-Indigenous racism against Métis people. And that without our useless socialist vanity party, we wouldn't have healthcare up here either.
Jackie, if I were to respond in kind, I suspect I'd be banned. In no way is Jagmeet a quisling, and your Jughead meme is ugly racism.
I'm angry and scared. Trudeau's rally in Mississauga was delayed 90 minutes because his SECURITY TEAM had to fit him with a BULLETPROOF VEST. They even had to get Sophie out of there early and now the trolls are trending Where's Sophie on Twitter starting up another vile rumor about their marriage. Simon, I hope you'll do an updated post on this. Even Con hack John Ivison is taken aback. The problem is none of these assholes are willing to acknowledge that this is the monster they've created with their constant negativity towards the man. His life is in danger and if Scheer forms govt he's promising to unleash the alt-right Kraken and open an inquiry into SNC. He and Harper don't just want Trudeau to lose, and to be locked up -- they want him DEAD.
CBC poll tracker now has the Cons marginally ahead of the Liberals in seat projections. The incumbent nevertheless still has the first crack at forming government. Blanchet seems to hate everybody and is only there "for Quebec" so who knows what the math will turn out to be? But if Trudeau is able to stay on for a little while longer in a lame-duck scenario, when the next election happens, I think he should let someone else take over and make plans to move his family out of the country. Write a book telling his side of the story and then hide out from these maniacs. There's too much hate for him. Canada is no longer safe and I've written to him twice in support saying how worried I am. Trust me, here in the States I've seen these right-wing stalkers going after Hillary Clinton and have said for awhile now that Justin is the male equivalent. He'll be hounded for the rest of his life. I don't have much room in my house, but if I could I'd gladly waive my 3rd Amendment right not to quarter a "national security threat" (according to Trump) just to keep them safe like Anne Frank in the attic. I hate what these fanatics have done to Canada and what they are doing to this beautiful family.
Hi Jackie,
Re: "I'm angry and scared. Trudeau's rally in Mississauga was delayed 90 minutes because his SECURITY TEAM had to fit him with a BULLETPROOF VEST."
Meanwhile, the 'Mop & Pail'(aptly named, given their slant) reports tonight that an excited crowd grew increasingly impatient when Trudeau arrived an hour and a half late without explanation....
https://www.nationalobserver.com/2019/10/02/analysis/will-andrew-scheer-ruin-canada
I know it is easy to get caught up in the election polls but I would point out only Nanos tells us how many of his respondents are undecided, and that number is still around 13%. I would imagine that the other polling companies are seeing the same thing. There are still alot of people out there who have not made up their mind and alot of election to go. It may not seem so but 8 days is a long time in the life of an election campaign, particularly the last 8 days.
The polls themselves are ridiculous. I saw one poll today that indicated that the Liberals and Conservatives were tied at 32% each. If anybody seriously thinks that any party is going to win this election with less than 35% of the vote they are dreaming.
Then there is the seat projections. They have proliferated as much as polling companies have and they are all very suspect. They take the national and regional estimates from public polls and feed them into a model to come up with a projection of the number of seats. They use demographic data or historical data to fill in the blanks, left by depending on public polls that discount the undecideds in their estimates, to come up with their seat projections. These models missed the Liberal majority in 2015. Similar models missed the Trump win in 2016. The got the Ford majority right but that was a no brainer. He was destined to win a majority from the beginning. They are not even useful for averaging out the polls because if you look at them and examine the list of polls they use they often leave some out, with no explanation as to why.
Fine, I'll call him Jagoff or Jackass if Jughead ruffles people's feathers. Doesn't change the fact that he's still a Con stooge splitting the vote and attacking the wrong enemy just to elevate his profile and own the neolibs. Someone on Twitter nailed it when they said it's all about elevating him to the top of the progressive food chain by cannibalizing the "uninspiring centrist" Trudeau. But I'm sure he'll have lots of success pushing for progressive utopia when his useless socialist vanity party comes in fourth to two racist separatist parties, one from Quebec and one that wants Alberta to either be the 51st state or Calgary to be the capital of Canada as the 51st state. That useless socialist vanity party is going to be indirectly responsible for ending Canada's healthcare system by splitting the vote to elect Cons. Isn't it ironic, don't you think.
But there's just no convincing progressive perfectionists to accept mathematical reality, and that's why I hate them. Their circular firing squad and asinine purity tests are what condemn innocent people to the likes of Trump, BoJo and Alt-Right Andy. And they absolve themselves with dumb excuses like "Justin didn't do PR" or "Hillary didn't campaign in Michigan." We warned you. Hillary warned you. Justin warned you. If you choose not to listen, it's not our fault. We tried.
Don't start crying "But her emails" or "But electoral reform" when women are bleeding to death from back-alley abortions and the Charter gets ripped up in favor of the U.S. Constitution complete with freedom for hate speech and a 2nd Amendment. You're not punishing Trudeau, as he'll probably end up fleeing Canada to move his family somewhere in Europe so he doesn't get shot or face a kangaroo-court star chamber over the SNC nonsense. Progressive spite would be to blame for that result just like it was here, the Jagoff Sanders of the world who let unrealistic perfection be the enemy of the good. Not Hillary Clinton and not Justin Trudeau.
Hi Jackie, Interesting to note that the Sun's editorial headline states that Jagmeet is a likeable guy. They would indeed like him a lot if he split the vote enough to hand Scheer the election. Other than that, they have no use for Singh. Split the left and the Cons are off and running straight to the trough.
How can people be so dumb to not see this happening?
JD
Wornout registered a Chrystia website. He's trying to drive a wedge in the Liberal Party again and set Trudeau up for a leadership review since his palace coup with JWR didn't work. If that fails he'll throw a hail Mary pass and try to replace Trudeau with Paul Martin. And if that fails he'll try to replace Trudeau with one of the kids from the viral Facebook video, or the mom, or P.J. Fournier's cat. Interesting that the website was conveniently registered just as the Mop & Pail released the Peter Mackay story about the knives out for Scheer. Probably through Rebel Domains or some other Hamish shell company. If his spidey senses are still tingling after all this, he needs to quit yanking it to Trudeau's yearbook and stop fantasizing about high school forbidden romance stories he pulled out of his ass.
Meanwhile, Lawton and Malcolm are "just asking questions" re: the bulletproof vest incident, leaving their unhinged followers to spread truther conspiracies that it was staged to generate sympathy because he is struggling in the polls. The rest are saying Canada needs its own Hinckley, Oswald or Booth and challenging each other to come forward and be a "patriot." So much for standing on guard for thee.
Scheer released a predictably weak response failing to acknowledge that it's his frothing mob responsible for the hatred against Trudeau. Note the language: Thank you to the RCMP for keeping "us" safe. Not keeping "him" safe, keeping Trudeau safe. A mealy-mouthed general "us." He can't even bring himself to say that because he genuinely hates Trudeau that much. The Romanian bloodsucker "fascinated" by the assassination of Ceausescu, what more can you expect?
I swear if one of these Rebel scum actually did shoot him, they'd claim he faked his own death. Someone posted that he took a day off last week to honor the memory of his brother at a family gathering. Responses were predictably vile and generally along the lines of the wrong Trudeau died. These people, Wornout included, need to be quarantined in a maximum security mental institution for the betterment of society.
You're right about the projections being all over the place. Fournier uses paywalled trackers, which shows his projections more bullish for the Liberals, while Grenier does not. Then there are countless others like Calculated Politics and Lean Tossup with their own methodologies showing similar but varied ranges. There's also been a flurry of Con-friendly polls dropped recently with a "house effect." For some reason Grenier weighs these more heavily than others. Again you're correct in that it's all completely random and there's no consistency even among the input data, yet because it's CBC it's taken as gospel. Some pollsters are so biased that at least one of them is so in the tank for the Cons he was victim-blaming Trudeau and jumping aboard the truther bandwagon implying that the security threat was staged. How can you trust these people's numbers when they're so blinkered in their perspectives?
As for the 32-32 tied poll, if it's the Abacus one you're referring to, they've been deadlocked for months. Yet I detect a little bit of strategic nudging in tandem from Coletto and Anderson's Twitter feeds vs. the actual content of the report. For the good of the country.
Coletto:
Half of [NDP/Green/BQ voters] (52% and 10% of the electorate) already think the Liberals will win, which means it will be harder for the Liberals to persuade them to vote strategically to block a CPC win unless they become convinced in the next week that a CPC victory is more likely. Another 30% of these NDP/Green/BQ voters who want Trudeau over Scheer feel the CPC might win or the outcome isn’t clear (5% of the electorate). These may decide to vote that feeling more readily since they are not convinced right now that the LPC will pull out a victory.
Anderson:
From our new poll. Because of progressive vote splits the @CPC_HQ is positioned to win, despite a striking rise in discomfort with Andrew Scheer.
Trudeau finally went at the NDP last night at the now-infamous Mississauga rally. Good. Electoral reform is not a single-issue, myopic hill to die on, and Singh is being disingenuous with his "vote your heart, not fear" BS, since he's on record as having advocated for strategic voting in 2015 when the NDP were in second place. Now that they're trailing but climbing he wants a taste of that power back and to own the neolibs. It won't get them any extra seats as they're in fourth behind the BQ, but the goal for him is to play the long game like Sanders did. Get Hillary Trudeau out of the way and position himself as the only progressive alternative to the maniacal TrumpCons after four years of hellscape leaves enough people desperate for "revolution." Except by that point it would be too late just like it is here.
I can't stand him, or Sanders, and I've been criticized for expressing just how much but I'm unwavering in my belief. He's an opportunistic, self-serving, partisan hypocrite, and the pie-in-the-sky purists and "bro-gressives" he invites are a borderline rapture cult who've spit out their own toxic vitriol toward Trudeau. Calling him a climate criminal, racist, warmonger, etc. As I often say he really is the male Hillary Clinton, whose best was never good enough.
Blanchet, meanwhile, is just a wrecking ball and a foot soldier for the racist premier. The very presence of his party poses an existential threat to the country. He's the French version of Jason Kenney and vice versa. Why is this insular regional party even allowed to run federally at all?
Singh is no better, JD. He's a narcissistic fame whore and his defenders are either ignorant or selfish. He seems to think he's in a position to take a 34-seat rump party to a 184-seat majority after a decade of Con destruction. So, literally the poor man's Trudeau and a pathetic imitation at that.
Hi Brawnfire....I noticed that too, and I found that beyond belief. Since when do we normalize a prime minister having to wear a bulletproof vest at a rally? But that's the Con media. They have disgraced themselves over and over again during the campaign, and their Big Oil/Big Business masters expect them to be consistent, or else....
HI Ottlib....All good points. There is also another factor that could influence the way the vote turns out. If people believe that the Cons are going to win some NDP and Green supporters could decide they better vote for the Liberals. However, there is also another far less attractive possibility,many that is that if the progressive vote splinters massively the Cons could get get more seats than most people imagine. I think I may need to be sedated on election night....😉
ya ty simon
federally 4 out of 5 of my neighbors voted blue
no one else said that it would be the last fptp election if elected
then he was , and he and his majority wouldn't....simple really
and yet it is somebody elses' fault...right? ...i get it
"a man sees what he wants to see and disregards the rest" simon and garfunkle
the beatings will continue until moral improves
Hi Jackie...Please try to spare me from Kinsella's deranged adventures. I despise him so much I even try to avoid Progressive Bloggers where I post this blog. Kinsella is so embittered I believe he is off his rocker. And he might as well have LOSER tattooed on his prominent forehead. It's best to ignore him, and sooner or later he will fade to black...
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