At least in Québec.
The federal government’s plan to destroy all data from its long-gun registry is unconstitutional, a judge has ruled, giving Ottawa 30 days to hand to Quebec records collected from the province’s gun owners.
“Quebec didn’t embark in the project of setting up a registry knowing that it would later be deprived of the fruit of its co-operation,” the judge wrote in a 42-page decision.
Glory, glory, hallelujah.
How bitter the miserable Con Vic Toews.
“I am disappointed with today’s ruling and will thoroughly review the decision,” Public Safety Minister Vic Toews said in a statement. “The will of Parliament and Canadians has been clear. We do not want any form of a wasteful and ineffective long-gun registry.”
How ugly the hatred of the diseased gun nutz who would turn us into Amerika...
How perfect the timing.
If there was any doubt that Québec is the last bastion of Canadian values, in this Con corrupted country, now there can be none.
All that remains to be answered is why don't the English-speaking provinces have the guts, and the decency, to do what Québec has done? And why do so many Canadians roll over so easily?
Oh boy. If I was in Montreal today I would have run, not walked, to this monument where the poor murdered women of the École Polytechnique are remembered.
And I would have said this:
Hey sisters, guess what? We won !!!!!!!!
The filthy Cons and their rabid Republican base tried to destroy your precious legacy.
But we didn't let them.
Je me souviens. I will REMEMBER....
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Standing on their graves huh? Quebec values are not and never have been Canadian ones. At the end of the day, you and those like you will lose. We will keep our guns and the left, well, lets just say they are sufferance, for now......Molon Labe!
ReplyDeletehi anonymous...you're entitled to your opinion, and I'm entitled to mine. And I've always been very clear about my position. I support the gun registry because I believe it can save the lives of police officers, paramedics and other first responders Some of whom are my friends. I don't want to take your guns away, all I ask is that you register them like a car or a dog. You can't change my mind, and I'm pretty sure I can't change yours. So we're going to have to agree to disagree. Have a nice day....
DeleteSimon, you're a typical half_retarded pot smoking Bum. remember, if you ever separate from the rest of Canada...who's going to give you your check at the end of the month ?
DeleteJamais été aussi fier d'être Québécois :)
ReplyDeleteMoi aussi.... :)
DeleteVive le quebec libre!
Deletewhatever, dingbats
DeleteHey Moron Label. (anonymous) There is nothing to compare Canadian or Quebec value in this post but values on a moral scale. STFup and stay on your side of the street. You are not welcome here with your drivel.
ReplyDeletehi zoombats....I have to admit I had to look up Molon Labe. When I first saw it I thought Molson Labe? Is that some new beer? But alas, it was only the stuff the paranoid imbibe...
DeleteMolon Labe? You've got to be kidding.
ReplyDeleteOne of the reasons that people are so concerned about guns is the bizarre paranoia of the supposedly persecuted gun owners.
hi Cathie...I honestly can't understand that kind of paranoia. I've suggested all kinds of compromises in the past, like making it super easy for people in rural areas to register their weapons. But I finally gave up. I'm glad at least that the legacy of those murdered women, and their loved ones who fought so hard to make Canada a safer place, will at least be honoured in Quebec....
DeleteIt's not about the registration, its about the impending confiscation, and the harassment by police if you forget to renew your PAL. And how about urban shooters. Many hunters and sports shooters live in cities. Easy registration for them? Car and dog licence is bad comparison. They are not in the criminal code, and it's not felony to have an unregistered car, or dog. the cops don't come, confiscate your animals or vehicles with threat of jail... but they do if you are a gun owner, and your PAL expires.
DeleteLaws make lousy memorials. The registry, which is still in effect in Quebec did nothing to save the life of Mr Blanchette. The only positive thing about the registry was that it potentially made owners more responsible for their fire arms. That's it. It is not a great police tool, as much as you wish it was, it is not. It does not protect women, as much as you wish it did, it does not.
I put forth that it is you who are the bigot in your portrayal of gun owners.
Quebec is welcome to start their own registry. Always have been. They can't afford it, but I'm sure they will find the money from somewhere.
Well deserved paranoia because of lefties crying bullet bans and gun registry and felony conviction for paper crimes. You don't understand. Gun culture has been a part of Canada since inception. Shooting was very popular up till the 70's, when liberals... really urbanites... started working their magic to change peoples perceptions of shooting. Fortunately, there has been a resurgence in the sport.
Deletehi anonymous...don't you get some reminders your PAL is about to expire before the cops show up? Because if you don't you should. Whatever my feelings about guns I certainly don't want gun owners treated like criminals. But surely there must be a way to make it work?
DeleteFor you do concede this:
The only positive thing about the registry was that it potentially made owners more responsible for their fire arms.
So how much do you think that's worth to first responders and their families? For I do know the registry makes them feel safer.
Finally, I'm not accusing anyone of being a bigot, and I'm not one myself.
What I'm saying is that if people in a province are overwhelmingly in favour of a gun registry they should be able to have one. And all this deleting of data strikes me as something out of Big Brother and should be halted immediately...
hi Red...please understand this, I recognize that guns are part of our history and woven into our traditions. I further understand, having been raised in a village, that guns can be especially important in rural areas. I wished I lived in a society with less guns, because I hate the pain they can cause, so suddenly and so easily. But I live in the real world, and I realize that's not going to happen.
DeleteSo all I'm asking is that in between blasting away you take a few minutes to fill out some forms. How hard is that? The fear and loathing this issue produces is simply ridiculous....
Fear and loathing has been directed towards gun owners for some time now. We are not the bad guys. Is there gun violence by gun owners? Yes. But very little of it. statistically gun owners are 3X LESS likely to murder than average Canadian.
DeleteI would be happy to fill out forms if it makes you feel safer, but are you willing to guarantee my right to own firearms? I doubt it. The progression to complete gun confiscations (like mass confiscations of 1995 after C-68, without compensation I might add)is a one way street. There is never going back. Gunregistry demise is a rare thing. Restoration of freedom? Rarely herd of in our collective society.
The gun registry has never made first responders any safer. Cops MUST approach any situation assuming guns are there. If they rely on registry, they are sadly lacking in training. Besides, what the registry SHOULD tell them is that there is a law abiding person in that house. Someone who has registered their guns.
Gun violence is dramatic and public, but there is way more knife violence, and more knife murder. It just isn't as sensational. Look at the national news end of any weekend, and you will see at least a dozen stabbings with several fatalities nationwide. Not headline news however like gun violence.
Oh, and no PAL reminders. Some police chiefs use it as means to remove legal guns from owners. They have list of expired PAL, visit homeowner, demand guns or face jail. Owners have 30 days to renew and claim guns, but it takes 6 weeks for PAL. Blaire in TO prime example. Halifax chief as well. Crusaders against gun owners. Use the numbers to pad their statistics of "illegal" guns removed from the streets.
DeletePS. I'm anonymous 12:54.
My fear is they will just ignore the courts and drag the thing out with more appeals, new legislation if they lose that, more court cases until they have destroyed all the data then, when they have no further recourse, say sorry we can't comply, the data no longer exists. I know it wouldn't be legal or democratic or but that does not matter to them
ReplyDeletehi rww...I wouldn't put it past them to ignore the courts and drag it out as you say. Which would be very disappointing, because I'd LOVE to see Vic Toews running off like a baby to the Supreme Court when he's spent half his life denouncing it.
DeleteAnd I fear for the safety of any data in this country, for as you know the Cons have an aversion to science, and any evidence that could be used to convict them. I mean can you imagine what the registry would look like if Pierre Poutine got his/their hands on it? We'd be the ones listed as having machine-guns.
So I don't know what's going to happen. But I do know this: the Cons are screwed whatever they do. If they piss off Quebec, after what just happened there, they can forget about seats in that province for at least ten years. And if they don't piss off Quebec their teabagger base will go WILD and start screaming Melon Label or Molo Holo or whatever at Harper. So how can we lose? ;)
Sort of like how Quebec ignored the will of parliament eh?
DeleteNah they won't drag it out to long. They'll take it to the Supreme Court where Quebec and the lower court will be reminded that the registry and the rest of the firearms law has already been decided as the sole jurisdiction of the Federal government and that any effort Quebec made was in furtherance to and as an agent of that federal law. Then it will be over as the LGR gets it's much deserved death. It never saved any lives. Any first responder that wasted any time believing it would have got killed by their reliance on it and in the end it was total waste of time and money.
ReplyDeleteThis...
Deletehi anonymous... I hope you don't mind if I ask you what you're smoking? Because I want some !!! EVERYBODY should be that wildly optimistic. But here's the bummers:
Delete(1) First it would have to go to the Quebec Court of Appeal, where I can think we can count on things going our way. If you know what I mean.
(2) The Supreme Court may or may not decide to intervene, and if it does it may very well rule on our side. Declaring that the government had the right to scrap the gun registry, but not the right to destroy the data which was owned and paid for by the feds AND the province.
(3) Quebec which already has a copy of the data, will use it to set up its own Gun Registry. In fact, I thought I heard somebody on French TV saying the police were already updating it. Effective TODAY.
(4) The reason Quebec will have its own gun registry, is because after the recent shooting on election night, the registry is more popular than ever. And Harper will have to worry about the political consequences. Which could be unfortunate for your side because as I'm sure you know he's NOT a man of principle.
(5) Have you ever considered that Harper might just roll over, and claim that it's up to the provinces to decide how they administer their justice system? I mean that's what he believes in, and what he's doing to our medicare system, so why wouldn't he?
So you see, if I were you I wouldn't be quite so optimistic. Finally, on a happier note, I'd like to encourage you to visit our beautiful province, so you can learn more about how we feel about gun violence. You won't be asked for your passport or your Quebec Gun Registry form, and as long as you don't tell them you're from Alberta, all you'll have to endure is a full body scan.... ;)
To Anonymous9:00 PM: no, the feds don't have sole jurisdiction; the previous SCC ruling was that they CAN have jurisdiction TOO if it's an overriding public safety consideration, but not that the provinces CAN'T have jurisdiction, under property laws. Indeed, even Toews concedes that even municipalities are within their rights to impose a registry if they want to: http://www2.canada.com/edmontonjournal/news/story.html?id=359501ee-fbd7-4c84-8b53-edc8c1ea28cd&p=2
DeleteI guess we will butt heads a bit on this issue Simon as I myself don't support the gun registry. Having said that I can understand understand the urban/rural divide on this issue. Having lived in many small, isolated communities all over the country, I never batter an eye when I saw a firearm slung over a shoulder. I never feared for my safety but living in a small city now, do i worry if my neighbor had a gun? Not really, I suppose...only if it somehow went missing, so yes, I can understand city-dwellers' concerns about that on this issue. I'm not a gun owner myself but I've certainly been exposed to them and feel comfortable using them (for legal purposes of course :) ) I suppose my big hang ups on the Registry were the ballooning cost and also that I've always felt it wasn't particularly effective. It's never saved any lives as far as I know. I think it just makes it safer for law enforcement officials but does nothing to protect everyday people. Having spent many years in Nunavut part of me feels this money would have been much better spent on much needed infrastructure rather than on demanding a group of hunters fill out paperwork in a language some of them don't understand. But anyhow, just my two cents. I know I won't change your mind nor you mine. I will say that the die-hard gun nut do irritate me though. Really, people that angry and paranoid shouldn't be allowed to have guns.
ReplyDeletehi Way Way Up...I hate this debate because of the way it divides us, and pits city people against people who live in rural areas. But I don't mind arguing with a reasonable person like you, it's the aggressive paranoid people who scare me.
DeleteI also have to admit that I've always been biased against guns. When I played Cowboys and Indians as a boy, I ALWAYS wanted to be an Indian with a bow and arrow. But I simply can't understand why registering a gun, like a car or a dog, is such a big deal. If it costs too much to register a gun, or there's too much paperwork, then make it cheaper and simpler. Give rural people a special break or whatever. But letting paranoia trump reason is not the way to go. And the facts are the gun registry does save lives, does have an effect on gun violence, and suicides.
The only reason the cost of setting up the registry ballooned was because of the incompetence of the government, and because it was deliberately sabotaged by gun owners and their organizations. In the computer age it could be cheap and simple.
And besides isn't making life safer for police officers and paramedics worth ANY price?
And don't they have the right to at least FEEL safer?
I know the gun lobby says that when first responders arrive on the scene of anything from a shoot out to a domestic dispute they should be at the same level of alert. But in real life it doesn't work out that way. They may be tired, they may be stressed, they might be buried in paperwork. They might have seen too many screaming people or corpses that week. It's very easy to let down your guard, and be surprised when the hysterical husband of the hysterical woman walks out of the washroom carrying what looks like an elephant gun and threatens to shoot himself. But if you knew there was a gun in the house, you might be jogged out your trance sooner, and it could save your life.
Not worth it? Tell them and their families.
Oh well. I figure what will eventually happen is that Quebec will eventually get its own gun registry. It's a tailor made issue for Marois, and you can be sure she's going to make Harper wear it. And of course the argument will rage on, the gun lobby will try to convince the already converted that it's all a separatist plot to seize their guns, and transport them to one of Obama's concentration camps in Chicoutimi, where they will be forced to insult the Royal Family, and have French shoved down their throats.
Tabarnac. I don't know if I can stand it. Only in Canada eh? ;)
In your scenario of hysterical woman and suicidal husband, how exactly was the gun registry going to protect anyone in that circumstance? Truth is it won't, nor can it.
DeleteParamedics and firefighters have no access to the registry, and the fact that Police can id the resident as a PL holder should indict that there are likely firearms in the dwelling.
You know what protects first responders? Guns. Their guns. Hows that for irony?
You know what protects women in domestic situations? Knowledge. Knowing that they don't have to live like that . Knowing that there are options, and providing them options.
You say it is proved that the registry saves lives, but that simply is not true. I would like you to point out ONE instance where the registry has saved a life, just one. Please.
from your post 1:55 I can see that you characterize gun owner as the bad guy. When in fact, we are the good guys. RCMP even say so. Vetted and vouched for as upstanding citizens. If you could tell a gun owner by looking at them, you might want to head to them first when in need of help. It's likely they would.
DeleteAnonymouse at 9:00pm above said it right. Quebec will not win, it is a federal registry and will get burned. People in Quebec need to put on their big boy pants and move on and find a better cause. And stop bringing up the Polytechnique shooting, that happened over 20+ years ago... You people make it sound like your the only ones to face a horrific tragedy. That shooting has been milked for so long, if i was a family member i'd be appalled that people would not let them rest in peace instead of digging up the past every second and exploiting it for a useless cause.
ReplyDeletehi anonymous... read anonymous at 12:58. The situation is not as clear as you think it is. And remember this is also a highly charged political situation, Harper is desperate to try to get more than five seats in Quebec, Marois can make huge political mileage out of this, as can Mulcair. And you know old Harpo, votes come before principles. Sorry. But you voted for him I didn't...
DeleteHarper will not bend over for Qc. It makes him more popular in the ROC. The ROC is tired of Qc and special treatment for the province. Out west there is a lot of apathy over separation and the affect it would have on Canada. Many people have come to think it would be a good thing, and see Quebec as self centered. Like you say, Quebec embodies Canadian values. Well, that's not quite true. Quebec embodies Canadian values, as you see them, but others have a different perspective and history. I am from Quebec, and understand well from where you speak. I also understand and have come to sympathize with the western views of confederation, and Quebec's role in it. It is not black and white, and what you are seeing in harper is a direct result of too much governance from Quebec. Too much directive from Quebec, and an imposition of it's values over areas of the country that are not only rising in influence, but in autonomy as well.
DeleteJust remember: an unarmed populace is referred to as "subjects"; an armed populace is referred to as "citizens". When you make it that difficult for regular people to own guns, only the bad guys end up with them. The state of Florida is what they call a "shall issue" state for issuing concealed weapons permits and after that went into effect, their violent crime rate dropped dramatically. Australia took their people's guns away and now home invasions, armed robberies and murder have skyrocketed! You can make all the whiney excuses for people registering and/or not having guns you want but until you've had one pointed at you by a bad guy and you're helpless to respond because some idiot bureaucrats want to make some extra money off some half-assed registry that makes it almost impossible to legally own a gun and doesn't protect anybody at all anyway, you don't know what the hell you're talking about. F--k the gun registry.
ReplyDeleteTHe long gun registry has never saved any lives, what don't you people understand about that? why can't you get it through your heads? it's logic, statistics, you guys never seem to look at the facts, rather just make up your ideas using emotion, not facts. Many police officers are opposed to the LGR. Yes it's true. Say you are a police officer, would you trust that the home you are going to has no firearms because the LGR shows nothing? would you put your guard down because of these records that are maybe 50% reliable? if not less now!? you have to be kidding me! USE YOUR BRAIN PLEASE. Our handgun registry is just as bad, since 1934 there hasn't been proof of it ever saving one life.
ReplyDeleteYour so called victory in Quebec is hilarious, as most of the long-guns have been swapped and traded so the long gun registry would be a complete mess and even MORE inaccurate than before! what kind of victory is this? the only thing the LGR does for you is make you "feel" a little safer, but it's a false sense of safety. I am a gun owner, I have long guns and restricted rifles/guns, you know, the ones that are "scary", all black and military looking, I have lots of ammunition as well... and so do millions of Canadians, and guess what, there's no blood bath shooting as most lefties would think. Isn't that amazing? but of course this fact does not matter, because you will continue with your agenda until all good citizens are unarmed... and the bad guys will have most of the guns, isn't that touching? makes you sleep better doesn't it? continued.....
I'm a hard working Canadian, I have a family, pay my taxes, I try to live my life in the most positive way, try to help people whenever I can. When my son is old enough, I will teach him how to shoot a rifle, handgun, and shotgun. I will teach him how to safely use these firearms, in to be very responsible with them, as I am. I will teach him not be afraid of firearms, but to respect them and use them responsibly.
ReplyDeleteMany people in Canada have lost the meaning of responsibility, they want the government to take care of them, to baby them, to make them feel safe. Grow up Canada! teach your children HOW to think, not WHAT to think. I'm a die-hard gunnut (as some of you call it), I enjoy my hobby and pass-time very much, for anyone to take that away from me is wrong. Don't try to take away our freedoms as they do not interfere with yours, you can start banning everything in sight, but you won't be any safer, I promise, it just doesn't work that way, please understand. continued...
Quebecers really like their gouvernemama....
DeleteI did not come here to "hate" on you for your opinion, but think about it logically and study the facts, you will be surprised that these registries don't work. What can work is licensing people, getting them trained and background check before they are able to acquire firearms. I know it's like beating a dead horse, but, you ask the law abiding to register their firearms, and they do, but criminals don't register theirs, and they get to play (in the wrong way) with the fun fully AUTOMATIC rifles that have been prohibited since 1977 for law abiding people.
ReplyDeleteMy questions all: what makes you so afraid of us gun owners? do you really not trust anyone with a firearm? Are they really bad people? do you really believe so? Do you really believe that society would be any safer if firearms never existed? I guess we would then have to ban swords.... steak knives... any sharp pointed metal objects... pointed sticks... etc. etc etc... where does it end for a little bit of safe feeling we get out of banning things? Please keep an open mind! I was once an anti-gun just like you, I hated them, I was raised to fear them. I then moved from Liberal Toronto to Alberta, and people taught me not to fear them, and enjoy them, respect them. I slowly changed my ways, and I tell you it's a lot of fun! When I pick up a gun, rifle, or shotgun, I don't think about going out to shoot people, I think about going out to target practice, you have NO idea until you try it out. Before coming out to Alberta, I thought no one in Canada was allowed to own firearms.. wow was I sheltered. As back in my motherland where I was born, it was communist, only the fascist police/army could own firearms... and that led to a lot of killing of innocent people.
I know, I rambled on for quite a while there! I do apologize. Please go to your local range and just give it a "shot" ;) I think you will enjoy it, and respect people with firearms a little more, because many many many of us are very safe oriented and respect the firearms we put our hands on. THe only gun-control, is trigger control, and the only "control" should be put on criminals. continued....
hi anonymous...look I'm sorry but I simply can't agree with this:
ReplyDeleteJust remember: an unarmed populace is referred to as "subjects"; an armed populace is referred to as "citizens".
Maybe if I lived in Sherwood Forest in the time of Robin Hood, or in the jungle of Paraguay where Vic Toews was born, I might go for it.
But not in a modern democracy, in a post industrial society, in the 21st Century. And please don't quote Florida as an example for us to follow. For when it comes to guns they're one of the most backward places in America. Which is saying something because that whole country is a horror show of crazed gun violence.You know there's a study out there (you can google it) that shows that one of the biggest differences between liberals and conservatives is that conservatives tend to be more fearful. I'm afraid that all this paranoia over the gun registry is just another example. And that saddens me, because it must be awful to live in fear, when life is so short. It's not that I'm especially brave or anything, but I couldn't live like that....
can not think of a better way to say this
Deletebut with this gun ban in canada crime went up
(home intrusion wen up 14% in quebec since the beginning of this
gun register)
and these are fact in Quebec
and outher province All THIs make me sick
you prefere to let this ashole enter your hose let them kill your familly rape your sister an daugther
i will not let that apen i will use every thing in my hability to prevent that and not wit screaming.
use your head when thinking
In all outhers country where they ban gun's Crime wen so up that now they can not do anything about it.
But the law is using this to take what you work for all your life. because you forgote to re-new you PAL
The Police will enter your home and acuse you of anything they can think of. Is that what you want
if it is. then goud luck with the future.
Gun dont kill People do.
If anyone is afraid Simon, it is you who are afraid of gun owners. And that fear is what is driving the agenda to disarm civilians. As for that "study", please.... how ridiculous. I'm pretty darn sure there are some nasty studies out there showing some ugly things about Liberals as well, but let's have some common sense, eh? No one is afraid Simon, we are just fighting for a way of life that we see as being eroded by irrational fear from ideologically driven, albeit well intending individuals.
ReplyDeletehi Red... when you talk about gun owners you are probably thinking about you and your friends. But you forget that there are other kinds of gun owners, some of them are dangerous to others and themselves, and the gun registry does allow police to deal more effectively with them. Nobody, certainly not me, wants to erode your way of life, and as I've explained it's not ideological for me, it's only a way of making life safer for Canadians who operate in a world you can only imagine...
DeleteTrue. And in all honesty, the gun registry was essentially a sacrificial lamb. Most owners problems lie not so much with the actual registry, but with C-68, which criminalized gun ownership in the first place. Many would be much happier, and the issue would be a lot less contentious if it were a civil matter instead of a criminal one. C-68 made potential criminals out of us all.
DeleteFor me its a law and order issue...and I'm happy that the province I call home has chosen the side of law and order and has sided with law enforcement types in supporting the registration of firearms.
ReplyDeleteSome people don't like our cops, and would take away this valuable tool from them. I'm glad there's one government in this country that puts common sense over ideology.
hi Gordie....I see it the same way too, a simple way to make the lives of those risking death to protect citizens and heal the injured a little safer. Those who would deny them that tool should spend a week riding in a cruiser, or an ambulance, and I'm pretty sure they would change their minds in a hurry....
Delete@Red 2:15 - "Is there gun violence by gun owners? Yes. But very little of it. statistically gun owners are 3X LESS likely to murder than average Canadian."
ReplyDeleteThis has been bothering me. Could you cite a source for this? Trying as honestly as I can, the only similar statistic I can find show gun owners are 3x more likely to be murdered themselves.
I'll show you mine, if you show me yours...
Deletehttp://www.nfa.ca/presentation-dr-gary-mauser#claim1
"If there was any doubt that Québec is the last bastion of Canadian values, in this Con corrupted country, now there can be none."
ReplyDeleteI would have to agree with the sentiment of this statement. If there is a political force in this country for conservatism, that is to maintain our culture and heritage, it is emanating from Quebec. The "New West" is radical and reformist as Red alluded to.
The debate over the long gun registry is a great way to rouse passions and divide the electorate. There has been amnesty for long gun owners since 2006 but the fear of jail is still enough to get many of them talking and voting.
Gun violence is a problem in Canada. When people are shot in Scarborough or Mayerthorpe, that's a problem. The sad part is the conversation is stuck on the LGR issue. We need to have a conversation about effective gun control in Canada. Maybe the LGR isn't the entire answer, but advocating for it's destruction can't be the only gun control policy that's ever discussed.
This issue has been milked and keeps on giving. If you are passionate about the destruction of the registry (you want it destroyed), I'm sorry but you've been duped, played. Thanks for your vote. In the end it's still the same exercise to round up and confiscate all of the guns and ammo should it ever come to that. If you didn't notice, people are being wrongly harassed and arrested in this country anyway.
Maybe we should be less concerned about each others political dogma, provincialisms or otherness, and more concerned that we are all neighbours, friends and family facing a changing and confusing world.
Peopl;e are being wrongly arrested and harrassed. If you think about it, democracy has not proved itself fail proof yet. You complaine about Harper as the great evil... well, guess who is the last stand against tyrnay? Yes, ordinary gun owners. That's who. If Harper comes knocking on your door because you look funny, and need to be locked up for the "safety" of society, what are you going to do about it? With no firearms, there is no recourse.
DeleteAn old gun saying. I would rather have a gun and never need it, than need a gun and not have one. There are no substitutes. If they take all the guns from the ordinary, law abiding citizen, who does that leave with guns? The stats and the criminals. That's it. Do you feel safer with them controlling your lives?
hi James...well said. The gun registry has aroused such passions on both sides, it has distracted us from looking at the wider picture.
DeleteAnd I absolutely agree with this:
Maybe we should be less concerned about each others political dogma, provincialisms or otherness, and more concerned that we are all neighbours, friends and family facing a changing and confusing world.
We need to put blind ideology and paranoia aside, and work to make all of us safer....
We need to put blind ideology and paranoia aside, and work to make all of us safer....
DeleteThis from you Simon? Really?
You average about one blog post per day, and each and every single day, it's unversally about how awful and destructive the Conservatives are, and how they're ruining Canada with their double-secret hidden agenda.
If there's bling ideology, and paranoia coming from anywhere, it's comming from you, and people who share your political views.
I don't think anybody believes that you have to like Harper, or his party, nor do you have to agree.
But misconstruing the closure of the Canadian embassy in Iran as some kind of plot to bring about biblical Armegeddon? And you say you're not a bigot?
What's worse, you've been known to agree with commenters who insinuate that we firearms owners who support the Conservative party are, to paraphrase Dave, plaid-shirted, crackpot, paranoid hillbillies with an unhealthy attraction to firearms.
Let's see... I hold a University degree from a top-level Ontario University. I live in the city. I think I only own one article of clothing in plaid. I don't consider myself particularily paranoid, but as a licensed owner of firearms, I do tend to feel uncomfortable by the encroachment of the state upon my civil liberties, of which, I've had to forfiet most in exchange for the privilege of owning firearms. My neighbor also owns firearms, including some bad scary restricted guns, has two Master's degrees, and feels similar to myself. We're growing tired of contstant, unnecessary state scrutiny while Toronto acts like a free-fire zone, and what do you have to say to us? Firearms owners simply MUST fill out MORE paperwork! And worse, you're trying to tell us that we're being blindly ideological when your blog positively oozes more hatred, fear, and vitriol than pretty much all of the rest of the Progressive Bloggers combined?
I used to think of you as a clown Simon, but this kind of blindess can only exist in something much different. A clown knows what he is. You're no clown, you're a bully.
'It's not about the registration, its about the impending confiscation, and the harassment by police'
ReplyDelete- Cops, doctors, nurses, paramedics, all were in favour of the gun registry because it saves lives. The problem are these Harper Reform Party crackpot paranoid hillbillies who want to be able to pack as many guns and as much ammo up to their eyeballs as possible. The sooner these retread, intolerant, flag-stomping Reform Party worshiping deadbeats croak off, the better. Until then these crackpots will remain utterly convinced the guvmint is out to steal their land and wardrobes full of plaid shirts, arms, and ammo. Take that focal point away, and their whole worldview collapses into incoherence. These loons have so much guns and ammo on the brain that the lead content in their heads is dragging them down so far they’ll soon need a new planet with less gravity to keep their faces out of the dirt.
Bigot much Dave? I happen to be a yuppie. Suburban dwelling, German car driving, professional person. But you keep up your paranoid stereotyping end of things, and us hillbillies will too.
DeleteNonsense. Perfect example of the hate spewed towards the average gun owner by a know not. Way to go Dave!
Oh, and Dave... those crackpot hillbillies are not the ones out committing the vast majority of murders that you pretend to be so concerned about. Gun violence by licensed owners is sporadic and rare. It can often be sensational, but it's occurrence is rare. Sorry if that pops your hate bubble. Besides... how do you know how we vote? Maybe it's hatred just like yours that is responsible for the current administration? Maybe there are many gun owners who would be happy to vote Liberal or Green (many of us are naturalists and conservationists) or even NDP. You and your high and mighty, know better ilk just keep up the pretense. Probably the best thing you can do for Harper. It is you who are living up to the stereotype Dave.
DeleteBoy are there a lot of whack jobs here. Common sense right out the window.
Deletehi Dave.... I keep repeating this:
ReplyDeleteCops, doctors, nurses, paramedics, all were in favour of the gun registry because it saves lives.
Because I know this to be true. But some of these gun owners are trapped in their own reality, and refuse to accept the reality of others. Which is ugly, bloody, and violent. It doesn't make sense. Some of those who shout I support our cops the loudest, are the ones who would make their lives, and the lives of other first responders more stressful and dangerous. It's madness I tell you...
PS. I AM one of the above.
DeleteSorry Simon,
DeleteBut the testimony during the debates for C-19 shows that there are a large group of Cops, doctors, nurses, paramedics that don't agree with your blanket statement.
You also keep saying that the registry saves lives. Please explain this in detail, Iwould love to hear it.
I also am one of the above and do not support the registry.
Wow, this Simon fool is a fairly typical deranged liberal. Seriously, I could sit here and embarrass you by countering all your points, some of which are beyond ridiculous, but in the end it's a waste of time (and bandwidth). You are so convinced you're right, no stats/logical reasoning/common sense would make it through to you.
ReplyDeleteI welcome the day that Canada has a referendum on whether or not to keep Quebec and continue pouring other provinces money into that joke of a province.
RE: why don't the English-speaking provinces have the guts, and the decency, to do what Québec has done?
ReplyDeleteEasy, because it doesn't make any sense and doesn't serve any meaningful purposes.
14 innocent women died at the politechnique because the police waited outside for the lunatic to run out of ammunition. 14 young women died because none of the guys in the room bothered to fight back...
~
The rest of Canada has clued in that pointless paperwork is NOT an effective way of dealing with disturbed/violent/lunatic.
The registration status of a weapon (whether it be a gun/knife/car) is irrelevant.
Just saying.
I'm a doctor and my wife is a nurse. My aunt is a paramedic. No one in the medical field has any knowledge of the fire arms registry. Firearms are not an issue unless in our line of work unless it is hunting season and people are asking for time off. It is becoming extremely tiring that the Gun Control Organizations keep spreading lies and trying to mislead the public.
ReplyDeleteWell said!
DeleteHi Simon
ReplyDeleteYes, the medical, police and legal professions all were in favour of the registry for good reason.
'Gun violence by licensed owners is sporadic and rare.' 'Crackpot hillbillies aren't committing the murders.'
- typically this wingnut conveniently divides guns into 'dangerous ones' and 'not dangerous ' categories, like that has any basis in reality. Gun violence by guns that were stolen from licensed owners, isn't rare! Happens all the time and that's what the registry was FOR. Killing a registry that the police wanted and used to aid them in crime fighting is not a victory for anything other than base stupidity. How can a political party so obsessed with law and order kill an important tool valued by all the police chiefs in Canada? Their hypocrisy would be laughable if it wasn't deliberately increasing the danger our police officers are going to be facing every day. You hillbillies probably want the first day of deer-huntin' season to be a national holiday and oppose the gun registry because all of your families have at least one long gun that's been in the family for at least one generation, named after the person who originally owned it; "Fetch me Grandpa Jake's gun, boy, cuz I'm going a deer-huntin' eh." And how did the Gun Registry "criminalize" the owning of guns by farmers and hunters, anyway?? It was a registry, not a police blotter. My brother in law owned several long guns when the registry came in. He got the forms and registered them. End of story. That's it, that's all. No big deal. But kill an entire registry because some Elmer Fudd's out there are too dumb or lazy or paranoid to fill out a form? Please. These are the mud-dumb idiots who keep yammering on about how they are saving us all from the totalitarian fascist govmint. What WAS subject to confiscation, and rightly so, were illegal firearms; they were assault rifles, automatic and semi-automatic weapons good for only one thing: killing people. Does one really need an AK-47 to take down some ducks? Blasting a whitetail deer with an assault rifle with hollow-point bullets is likely to over-tenderize the meat. Sure, a shotgun or a rifle can be used for hunting. But there should be a registry for them no matter how lazy, dumb or paranoid you yahoos are. I don’t see the need for hunting anyway, but if you must shoot a fucking deer to make up for the fact you have a tiny dick, go right ahead. It’s your right, I guess. And, the crackpot NRA poured a lot of money into the Tories campaign and this was the payback. It reveals how our politics have become Americanized with Harper. The registry was a fundraising tool used by Harper to separate dimwits like you guys with your cash. The only people who wanted it killed were conspiracy theorists who were delusional enough to actually believe the government was out to take away their right to own property, and guvmint agents were going to one day come a gunnin' for yer house and take it and your plaid hat collection.
Hollow-points? Shows what you know. Expanding rounds like hollow-points is what is legally required to hunt any large game. Stupid liberals, they never learn. But hey keep trying maybe one day people like you will be taken seriously again.....lol maybe.
DeleteDave is so angry I hope he never has access to firearms. He is the type to go off on a murderous spree for some ideological reason. Dave, I sense that you are projecting your own insecurities, and self doubt onto a group of people who have done you, or society no harm. Gun stolen from owners, used in crime... and exactly HOW id registry supposed to help aside from return gun to owner? We live beside the US in case you have not noticed (but I'll bet you hate them too) and there is a readily available and inexhaustible supply of guns right there. Legal owners are not the problem.
DeleteAnd what's this good-bad nonsence. Guns are guns. The people who use them, well, they might be good or bad.
Get some help buddy. And buy a plaid shirt.
Another gun-owning troglodyte chiming in! The registry always was useless as a crime prevention tool. Bill C-68 has over a hundred pages and only two address criminal misuse of firearms. The rest is aimed at the law-abiding. And you wonder why we hate c-68?
ReplyDeleteI guess I'm just a dumb gun owner though. Maybe I'll just give up on this whole engineering gig I've got going on and beat my wife or something. Sound good Dave?
'I'm a doctor and my wife is a nurse. My aunt is a paramedic. No one in the medical field has any knowledge of the fire arms registry. Firearms are not an issue unless in our line of work unless it is hunting season'
ReplyDelete- Really. Because you sound like a crackpot plaid hat Elmer Fudd to me, pretending to be a doc.
"As front-line physicians in emergency departments, we regularly witness the horrific injuries and deaths that result from firearms," said Dr. Carolyn Snider of the Canadian Association of Emergency Physicians.
And to her, too. Where did you go to med school, University of a-Huntin' a-Fishin and a-Shootin'?
What school did you go too Dave? The Liberal-school-of STUPID? How's Iggy doing these days? lol
DeleteThe registry doesn't prevent crime. Never has, never will. Sure, it can aid in solving a crime, but the registry never prevented a death. So you're ok with people being murdered, so long as there is a paper trail to the criminal? That's just like the politicians calling it a victory when people stopped committing suicide with firearms. Sure, suicide by firearm went down in statistics, but suicide by hanging increased. The fact anyone can call that a victory is pathetic.
ReplyDeleteInstead of banning this, that and the other thing, why not go after the criminals doing the shooting, the illegal importation of firearms and the law breakers? Why punish the people who use firearms to hunt, sport shoot or predator control. You do realize there are a lot of sporting shooters who make money by competing right? Now you're going to limit their income? You're going to take away their right to work? How can you justify that? Is it because you think we're all plaid shirt wearin', gun slingin' paranoid hillbillies?
You can't ban guns, you can't ban ammunition. It's been tried before and actually ended up causing more crime. Remember the days of prohibition? Yeah, that went over really well. Truth of the matter is, it isn't the law abiding, "gun totin', flannel wearin' hillbillies" that commit crimes in the streets of our cities. It's the criminals. You know the guys who don't care about your laws, your rules. They follow their own set of rules. They're the one's shooting up our cities and our malls. They're the one's smuggling and illegally importing firearms into the country. Not us.
There are roughly 7-8 million licensed firearm owners in Canada. On average a firearm owner will own 3 guns. That's average. Now multiply that with the number of firearm licenses that have been issued. That's a lot of guns. So, by your way of thinking, since guns kill people and we're all crazy lunatics, then how are our streets not running red with blood from all the legally possessed firearms in Canada? How is the murder rate so low compared to how many firearms there are? It's because we're not paranoid, we're not criminals. We're law abiding citizens with a love for target shooting and hunting. We go to work every day, we pay our taxes and we love our families.
We don't criticize you for the hobbies you like. So don't criticize us and try to restrict our way of life.
P.S. - Flannel is very warm in the winter. This is Canada. In case you haven't noticed, Canada gets really cold. I love my flannel.
Hi Guys,
ReplyDeleteI guess I’m a lib who has taken up gun ownership for sport -- that'll blow your minds – actually that’s not true, I’m leaning more towards the NDP, always have, owning a gun isn’t going to change that.
1) Restricted guns, so all handguns, "scary looking rifles" etc are still and have been for a long time required to be registered - dropping the registry won’t change that.
2) Does it really matter though _what_ guns are registered to someone’s house? If I was a police officer or a paramedic or anyone else worried about guns on a call, I'd just want to type the address in the computer and have it spit back "an occupant in this house has a firearms license"
I wouldn’t care if they had 10 guns or 1, it would just be nice to know. This is already possible, since everyone with a firearms license has to submit all their info to get the card and it’s illegal to not notify them BEFORE moving to a new address.
As an outsider coming into these nasty arguements online, both sides seem like douchebags. Each side is going to pull out reports and quotes from people supporting their views..
stop being shitty to each other and hug it out. We're all canadians! Unless Quebec separates, then fuck you guys!
The registry may not prevent crimes? Depends how you look at it. If not, then explain why there was a 40 per-cent reduction in homicides by long guns once the registry was introduced? Coincidence? Or why there was such strong majority support for it by police associations across the country who claimed to refer to it 17,000 times a day.
ReplyDeleteAs for your paranoid delusions, the Registry in no way impugns anyone's Charter Rights, nor their right to possess long guns. You register your car, does that mean, according to these sophists, that the government wants to take your car away? Does it in any way criminalize driving?
The simple answer to both questions is: NO
But stir up the fear in the mouth-breathers that registering their long guns somehow makes them criminals and they fall entranced in lockstep with the Conservative, if not NRA, talking points.
If it's a gun, long, short, tall, or fat it's a weapon that can kill, and hence like all other guns in this country it needs to be registered. If you think differently, then move to the country south of us. There is no room here for a bunch of whining, gun-toting misanthropes that don't understand basic logic.
Actually you (and those like you) had your chance and you failed. Now, people like you have two options. You can accept that the LGR is dead and live with it, or you can leave Canada. The choice is yours......or maybe people like you can be tossed out.
DeleteAfter all Minister Kenny is revoking fake Canadian citizenships............because to be frank there is no room for whining, gun-grabbing leftards that can't accept their own failures.
Funny how all the shootings in Canada happens in Quebec?
ReplyDeleteNot really, it is a fucked-up place.....I mean just look at the people who rise to the top of the shit pond there.
Delete'Funny how all the shootings in Canada happens in Quebec? '
ReplyDelete- 'Happens', eh? Did ya seen it, too?
If you look at the murder rate in Canada it has been dropping steadily since the 70's with no appreciable increase in declines with the introduction of C-68 or gun registry. Dave is buying into the CGC fear mongering and propoganda.
ReplyDeleteIronically, now that the gunregistry is gone, police report to access it 19000 times per day. Gee, could it be the CPIC they were accessing all along, and those stats by the fear mongerers were lies? You bet.
You are a liar Dave, and don't know what you are talking about aside from the media sound bites that have formed your opinion. Moron.
On a side note, kudos to Simon for hosting discenting opinions. I'm out.
Canadian licenced Firearm Owners are law abiding or else we legally would not be permitted to possess firearms. Sadly, the aggressive left wingers have spread irrational baseless fears of an object and gun Owners. The long gun registry is a product of that, never proven to have saved one life. The criminals who use guns should be the focus of Public safety, not law abiding Canadians who hunt or shoot for sport such as Olympics. Criminals should be registered and monitored.
ReplyDeleteCanadians who don't own firearms are unlikely to know the rules/law we have to adhere to. They are easily led to believe that guns are bad and need to be banned. Licening, safety training, registration, class' of firearms, safe storage/transportation are just some of the laws, one paperwork slip up and it could be all over.
Liberal/NDP testimony at C19 Committee have confirmed the firearm Owners they know are very law abiding, pillars of the Community. The anti-gun groups will not point this out but say, gun Owners cannot be trusted, they are just one step away from shooting ppl?
Police Officers, Conservation Officers, Olympic shooing medalists and others testified the LGR did nothing for Public Safety, why continue?
It's absolutely amazing to read this kind of hate drivel. Yet it's the the law abiding citizens of Canada who believe in individual property rights that are the ones portrayed as crazy, not the wierdo's with coloured hair, shedding clothes and wearing Guy Fawkes masks (a hilarious failure to all of us educated in history since Guy Fawkes wanted to blow up British Parliament to install a more radically CONSERVATIVE religious based gov't btw), throwing garbage cans at police and vandalizing shops.
ReplyDeleteWhen will this country wake up and finally realize just how twisted people like this crappy (1st yr uni maybe) blogger is?
I'm an ivy league educated firearm owner (Queen's '07/MBA Cornell), I hunt and target shoot and I'm proud of my hobby. I plan on doing these things with my son long into my autumn years. What right do any of you have to restrict me from owning any type of property? I've never even had a speeding ticket, I don't drink, smoke or use illegal substances. In fact, like most Canadian firearm owners in Canada, I'm a model citizen.
You can go ahead and argue any emotional, hate filled speech you want but do it behind closed doors where the rest of us don't need to hear your little drum circles. That's your right under the Charter, but that right ends when you try and restrict or compromise the rights of others.
We respect your rights, give us the same respect in return and we can all get along just fine.
It's not hard, just try practicing what you preach!
Dave - violent crime has been dropping in canada since the mid 70's. The registry didn't come into effect until around 2001. How can a trend that started 30 years before the registry be attributed to the registry? How could we have had a lower crime rate and gun crime rate in 1962 when there was little to no gun control? Nice try though.
ReplyDeleteFurthermore, the registry does criminalize gun owners. It was a criminal offence to a)be in possession of a firearm without a valid PAL or RPAL (section 91&92 CCC) b) be in possession of an unregistered firearm, c) not provide proof of authorization to possess firearms d) not produce a valid registration certificate for a firearm even though it is registered.
So the criminal sanctions imposed on gun owners are very real. Imagine facing up to 10 years in prison for OWNING a car without a driver's licence. Or how about a criminal charge for no producing valid registration for your car. Or dog. Or bicycle.
Furthermore Dave, the firearms act has reverse onus laws meaning the right to remain silent and not self-incriminate is gone. I suggest you take your utter hatred of your fellow Canadians who choose to own firearms elsewhere. Maybe do some research and learn a thing or two. Start with this googling these menaces to society. Johnathon Login. John Rew. Ian Thompson. Bruce Montague. Jesse Sansone.
ReplyDeleteAnd when you're finished ask yourself if gun owners are justified in their feelings of being treated as second class citizens
yeah, this is exactly why they shouldn't let uneducated hillbillies vote in an election.
ReplyDeleteYou my good sir are a retard and should not be allowed 50m from an computer. This coming from an Quebec lawful gun owner. You should step away from your blog and go pick flowers. Saying that lawful firearms owners are hill billies is just stupid. Using polytechnique as an example is simply sad and you should be ashamed. Then again, this is what blogs are all about. Uneducated people like you who only see life through their ass and want to share it with others hoping some one out there will notice.... Shameful. And I am for gun registry. Just needs to be redone from ground up.
ReplyDelete-Sigh- Its people making purely uneducated comments like the Original Poster, here, that prove that on one topic at least, liberals and lefties have their own blind spot; and their own bigoted uneducated masses. I am a diehard leftie - I support LGBT rights strongly, I support protection of the environment, I support socialized health care and education, etc. But, I also own guns. Legally. (Also, I will note that I a certified tradesman in my field; not 'some uneducated hillbilly.)
ReplyDeleteSad fact is, the gun registry as not saved ONE life. Not ONE. I challenge any leftie to prove it. I present the fact that both the Ecole shooting and the Dawson college shooting were committed by persons whose weapons were, in whole or part, ALREADY LEGALLY REGISTERED AND OWNED BY THE SHOOTER. Lefties such as OP love to forget this fact.
sad fact is, the claims put out by a pair of police cheifs to the Canadian government was proven, on video, to be a lie. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WGI368nzHcw&feature=player_embedded Yes, that is two Police Chiefs being caught lying to the government directly about the matter.
Sad fact is, Canadian gun owners that own guns legally are ALREADY registered to the government by default of having to obtain a PAL/RPAL. They have our full names, DOB, full address, and in the case of Restricted PAL holders, exactly how many handguns of what style/kind/brand are owned. The legal hoops are severely extraneous and serve no useful purpose; except to tax the owners.
Sad fact is, if lefties and liberals would actually take some time and learn about firearms directly - not bullsh!t seen on tv - they might find how sadly mistaken they are about the matter. Further, if they were to soften - or rather, take a more realistic - stance in regards to firearms, they would find they would garner substantial support from many thousands of people - people like me who generally lean left; but see the gun laws for the harassment and hindrance to law and society that they truly are. Hopefully, the OP and others will actually pause to consider this, rather than continuously regurgitating nonsense.
Finally, the topic of defense of life and self - I live in the Yukon (away from any town or city), and while I have lived in cities, firearms are both a way of life and a tool necessary for defense from wildlife here; it is not uncommon to see bears and other large predators traversing near my home. I am fortunate in that I have not had to 'defend myself' - yet. Where I live; it is an accepted fact that it will sooner or later happen.
~~ Alex in YT
The problem with the registry is that it has criminal penalites, as Red explained.
ReplyDeleteIt has never saved a life. In 30 years of debate, no one has ever been able to supply a name.
Gun owners are not persecuted???? Check out the 2010 RCMP Evaluation Report on The Canadian Firearms Program. From the report......."Continuous-eligibility screening is one of the most innovative features of
the CFP. Rather than just doing background checks at the time of licensing and renewal (as was done under previous legislation), the CFRS is dynamic and continuously updated as new information comes to the attention of the police and courts concerning the behaviour of licence holders. All current holders of firearms licences, POL (Possession Only) and PAL (Possession and Acquisition of further firearms), are recorded in the Canadian Firearms Information System (CFIS). CFIS automatically checks with the Canadian
Police Information Centre (CPIC) EVERY DAY to determine whether a licence holder has been the subject of an incident report in CPIC."
Note the term "EVERY DAY", This is not persecution? Pedofiles don't get that kind of attention.
BTW, it also makes for some pretty safe firearms owners.
Theft from gun owners? Criminal code section 98 and 98.1 allow for a life sentence for anyone breaking and entering to steal a firearm, or stealing one while breaking and entering. Hand that sentence out three times and gun theft from legal owners stops I bet.
In all, it's the criminals that are a problem. No list, or piece of paper will stop them. They are not on a list and they didn't apply for the piece of paper.
The LGR was a huge issue in Harpers election platform and he finally won a majority (partly because of it and the waste of money). Now Quebec defies a bill signed into law by the Governor General of Canada, and beats it's chest that they are smarter than the rest of Canada??
Rock on Yukon, but wait a min. I also support LGBT rights, gay marriage, protection of the environment, socialized health care and education, and decriminalization of pot. Does that make me a liberal too? How can that be? I own guns and support a gun owners right not to be discriminated against.
ReplyDeleteI'm confused. Maybe I'm just not like these liberals, and that's why they hate me so much.
French Seperatist fucks. Leave our country... go to whichever country will take you, and set up a registry from scratch on your own damn people. EVERYWHERE GUN CONTROL HAS BEEN SUCCESSFULLY IMPLEMENTED, VIOLENCE HAS FOLLOWED. WWII Germany (read Hitler), Communist China, Britian, Austrilia, etc.
ReplyDeleteCompare it to prohibition. PEOPLE WILL GET WHAT THEY WANT NO MATTER WHAT THE LAW SAYS.
or russia! they have severe gun laws, yet the highest gun murder!
Deleteas oposed to switzerland, which requires BY LAW that all men of millitary age to have a rifle in his home, and has amongst the lowest crime in the whole world. no win america look at chicago, the highest gun controlled city in all of america (or one of them) and they are also competing for gun murder capital of the states if not the world. as oposed to states that do not have these laws, or even has laws requiring their citizens to own weapons have much lower crime rates!
ho wpeople can say gun control works is beyond me! it only works on the very law abiding citizen! other wize the law only endangers people
Most of Canada's spree shootings have been in Montreal and most were done by university kids and a professor. Hardly the mouth breathing, knuckle dragging stereotype. Funny that.
ReplyDeleteI do believe in gun control...I believe the guns should be banned in Quebec. Seems all the nuts are in one basket.
yeah thats funny how all the worst crimes happen in the areas where the most severe gun controls are in place. yet people keep trying to use these events for gun control, if gun control worked then the oposite wouldbe happenng where higher crimes would be in lower gun controlled areas. but that is just not true. its always the places that are stricter tha get the most gun violence!
Delete'Most of Canada's spree shootings have been in Montreal'
ReplyDeleteAs a matter of fact, the city you are most likely to get murdered in is Prince George BC, not Toronto or Montreal. Saskatoon and Regina also have higher murder rates. Cut the shit.
I could legally have a dozen shotguns hiding in my home that could kill someone immediately, but I can't have a few pot plants hiding in my home that could make me giggle and eat too much. Wow, the 'logic' of the gun lobby & the Harper conservatives (and their yahoo supporters) escapes me. I'd guess that the majority of those that oppose the LGR would also have no problem with legalized weed. The same would go with Vic the Zombie Toew's idiotic warrant-less Internet spying bill.
There is no way that any computer database costs 'billions' of dollars to build and maintain. If this were the case then most companies would go out of business. This is a totally trumped up argument for why not to have a registry. It does not take rocket science nor billions to build a database.
Conservatives wanted to scrap this registry because they for the most part are in lock step with Republicans in the USA. Republicans defend the 'right to bear arms' so that they can be used to protect themselves from their own government. In other words, they are paranoid, deluded fuckers. That Amendment was written when muskets were the rifle of choice and most of them didn't even fucking work.
It's obvious why registering a gun is different than registering a car: accidental and intentional gun deaths are not uncommon, but homicide-by-car IS uncommon. If my neighbor has a rifle, it IS objectively more of a threat to me than the car parked in his driveway.
A functional, competent government must regulate issues of public health and safety. That certainly includes guns, cars, explosives, poisons, bacteria, etc. According to Stats Can, approximately 75% of all homicides are committed by family members or acquaintances of the victims. If one considers only female victims of homicide, the rate is much higher. In only approximately 15% of homicides is the victim a stranger to the murderer.
What this means is that at least fully three quarters of all murders in Canada are committed by family members or acquaintances against family members or acquaintances. Not all by guns, of course, but if both handguns and long guns were registered, then it could help protect police called to the scene of a ‘domestic’ incident; it could help judges when setting terms of restraining orders, and it could help in solving crimes if a suspect was a registered owner of a firearm of a calibre and type suspected in the homicide.
Furthermore, knowing a gun was registered and easily traceable might also deter someone from using it against a spouse.
You say that criminals don’t register firearms, but aren’t all murderers criminals?
Hi Dave, i made the mistake of posting a nice calm message earlier. My bad. Turns out, after reading some more of your posts, your a fucking moron. Nothing to do with gun control or anything.. It seems like, well sadly, your just a moron. So, hang your dumbass flag high and ignore what some of the more rational posters have said regarding gun control and the overlaps between the old database and the current licence registration system.
ReplyDeleteNow, now....Davy is just PO that Iggy lost his job.....lol
Deleteiggy? yeah that russian commie, who doesn't have brain matter! at least most liberals where smart enough not to vote for that idiot!
DeleteDave, as an opponent of the registry, I also support the legalization of pot. On another note, the insistence by some that all opponents are gun control are a bunch of Conservative, redneck illiterates has puzzled me. My sister is an urbanite, university-educated and typically votes liberal. She owns a gun. My uncle is a small-town business owner and a huge NDP supporter. He owns a gun. I myself am university-educated with 3 degrees an urbanite and consider myself centre-right yet have never owned a firearm in my life, although I am confident enough around them. I'm not sure that firearms owners opposed to the LGR fit as easily into neat little categories as their opponents make them out to.
ReplyDeletethat doesn't make sense, if you have and like owning a rifle or handgun, why the hell would you vote for the ver ones who would like to see guns ripped right out of our hands? or why would one vote for the national communist party of canada (NDP)?
Deletejust doesn't mke sense. none whatsoever!
hi everybody....thanks for all your comments. Just like I made my position clear so did you all. I'm going to have to give Dave the Simon Medal of Honour for standing up to such a barrage, and giving as good as he got. But everybody else gets at least a Bronze Star for keeping their comments relatively civil which isn't easy considering the passions this subject unleashes. I think that we all understand each other a little better now,I sure do, and that we helped break down some stereotypes on both sides. And although I'm sure we changed no minds, I hope that you understand that I am not one to suppress debate, nor have I any desire to seize your guns. And that I may be a fool, a clown, and a pothead, but I am never a bully. Thank you all again....
ReplyDeleteSimon - as a retired police officer (30 years) l feel that I must advise you that the Firearms Resistry has never saved a single life. Seriously. What it DID do was redirect vast amounts of funding from the areas that could of been helped...and that redirection of funds...initiated by the uneducated in order for them to 'feel' better...actually caused far more harm than good. Much like the people in the 20's who wanted to abolish liquor, all you have managed to create an underground source of illicit 'goods'.
ReplyDeleteCongratulations. It's people like you, with your uneducated and smugly self-rightious attitudes that are the real danger. There are now dead people in this country that wouldn't be that way...except for the fact that people like you exist...and want to impose your brand of stupidity on others.
"as a retired police officer (30 years)"
ReplyDeleteProve it anon, that being said you get to retire earlier than the rest of the tax paying public that paid your way in life...
Prove me wrong.
Anything such as the "Firearms Resistry' [sic] yours anon, as you say gobbles funds...
So did you?
Where do you draw the line?
We should actually take away your guns and outfit you like the London Bobbies with billy clubs...
http://curemontreal.org/police-killings-across-canada-since-1987-justice-pour-les-victimes-de-bavures-policieres
Go figure, I don't trust...
I have been told by a lady I trust who grew up in Denver Colorado whose brother was a Denver City Policeman that every shift carries a handgun with the serial number filed off.
So they can put it in the hands of the murdered innocent, that got sauntered by the police...
She proved it to me. Now that happens in every city...
Go figure, the long gun registry is a waste of money but so are guns for cops.
why reinvent the wheel....
ReplyDeleteCongratulations. It's people like you, with your uneducated and smugly self-rightious attitudes that are the real danger. There are now dead people in this country that wouldn't be that way...except for the fact that people like you exist...and want to impose your brand of stupidity on others.
Amen and God bless you:)
Shit I went to several schools, are you addressing me anon?
ReplyDeleteWere you ][?
Simon I ain't gay but I have no right to say nay...
Nor can I tell ANON to reinvent the wheel or did I say steel oops it was coal no no man it was Alberta Bitumen, known as dilbit um see here and have a belly laugh on me.........
Best satire I've seen in a long long time....
Are you ready?
http://thetyee.ca/Opinion/2012/03/16/Ethical-Oil-Rap/
http://www.statcan.gc.ca/pub/85-002-x/2008002/article/10518-eng.htm
ReplyDeleteLook at chart 3.
Do you see anything that would indicate major life saving legislation was enacted around 1995? I just see an overall downward trend continuing through the 1990's that registry proponents are somehow attributing to the registry (even though the trend started in the 70's).
Could somebody site me a real study that supports the long gun registries efficacy? Just one decent one? I only find self serving crappy ones where people start at 1994.
What really drives gun control is hateful paranoid prejudice
ReplyDeleteSimon:
ReplyDeletehttp://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/story/2012/09/21/pol-cp-toews-gun-registry-ontario.html
Read it! See, Quebec's ideas do die at the border.
did you know thta the highest gun crime rates in america are the very areas that have the highest gun control? and the areas with the lowest gun crime are the areas with the least gun control?
ReplyDeletebetya didn;t know that.
betya didn't know that hitler thought gun bans and prohibition worked too!
Marois have mentioned the fact about Gun crime rate in America. I have also read this statistics somewhere else.
ReplyDeleteone more thing about a shooting IN montreal Quebec as well that i forgot to mention, the school shooting in the university, what GOOD did the registery or gun laws do there? whose lives did it save? NO ONE! absoluetely NO ONE!
ReplyDeletenow if maybe just maybe some law abiding citizen had a gun with them, they could have saved a few lives, but nope, you liberals really live in delusonal worlds, where you think that gun control works, yet the only incidence you take to justify gun control, is shootings that already happen in GUN CONTROLLED areas.
look at chicago if you want the fruit of high gun control,
and ignore the "could have been trajedies" but a law abiding citizen carrying a fire arm SAVED lives.
why not look at those as well??? eh????
or do you prefer looking at extremely biased statistics, and at events that happen in already "gun free" zones?
There has never anywhere ever been evidence of the effectiveness of gun control laws in lowering violence. The CDC did a huge review of all the literature, all the studies, and found no evidence gun control has ever worked. Social factors, demographics, cultural factors are what count in terms of crime levels, not guns. The long gun registry will remain on the scrapheap and forever be seen as a huge ugly mistake linked to liberal ignorance.
ReplyDeleteRegisteration of the the guns are important as it will help the governemnt to know about illigal guns. Criminals don't register their illigal guns. Criminals will just steal your gun or get guns from illigal supply. Many people are against the registry program because it is a waste of money and completely worthless.
ReplyDelete